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MG Midget and Sprite Technical - Change hood frame

Hi,

Sorry I haven't been on in ages, I resolved to build a new engine to fix my cars oil sucking problem ( lets not even search for that ! ) and then the car got put in the garage and turned into a shelf then the Rover V8 failed it's MOT and here we are - at least four years later !

I now have new engine ready to go into the 65 Sprite and recently turned up a later rubber bumper midget hood frame and want to fit it to my earlier Sprite - I can't find a single article online - has anybody done it, or at least tried and can offer any advice.

Thanks in advance as this mod will finally get the Sprite the use she deserves.

Malc
Malc Gilliver

I can't see it being an easy job. You would also need to have a custom hood made.
Dave O'Neill 2

Hi Dave,

Just overlaying the frame on the car and it’s really close tbh.

The car is up in Derbyshire at the moment.

I agree it’ll need a bespoke hood, but I think it’s possible to convert a 1500 hood to suit.

Just hoping someone has done it
Malc Gilliver

Interesting. I'm more interested in doing the reverse.

Fitting an earlier removeable simple folding pole frame to my later Sprite. I like the clean lines of the earlier cars, over the convenience of the folding roof.
anamnesis

I know what you mean the earlier car does look‘cleaner’ and if you go out you can sit on the rear bodywork and use the axle kick up as a step, but it’s such a faff getting the hood into the boot, it only just fits corner to corner, takes ages to put up and take down. The car is stored in a garage when at my mum’s or gf’s but on the drive at mine so it tends to get used very infrequently, but if I could just lift or lower the hood in a minute then I’d be more likely to ‘risk the weather more “

Some did tell me there was a company back in the 60’s would convert the early hood to folding but I can’t find anything
Malc Gilliver

Malc. I too have a ‘65 mk3 Sprite and agree that putting up and taking down the hood, plus getting it into the boot is an absolute pain, but the ‘64-‘66 hood frame as you will know is located at the B post by just slotting it into two tubes, whereas the later cars frame is bolted to the B post and has a hinge at that point to allow the hood to fold back. The later hood is also fixed to the little upstand at the back of the cockpit.
The cockpit of the later cars is four inches longer than the ‘64-‘66 cars to accommodate the folded hood, so putting a later hood on your ‘65 car, if it could be done, would see it sitting on top of the rear deck when folded.

I think the reason you haven’t seen any articles on a conversion is probably because there aren’t any.
If you do solve the problem, please post here as I would love to know how it could be achieved.

Bernie.
b higginson

It has been done, there even was company advertising with it being done by them.
Soldering Instrument components LTD from London.

The advert is from Motor Sport Magazine august 1969, you might give them a call. LOL!!

Struggeling copying the link...
A de Best

Page 102 advert in right hand top corner.

https://www.motorsportmagazine.com/archive/issues/august-1969/
A de Best

How on earth did you find that Arie?

Well spotted.

What are you doing with your original simple two piece frame Malc?

As I said earlier, I like the idea of it being completely removeable, and wouldn't mind an old 2 pice frame to alter to fit my later type. So if your is going cheap? Lol.

Or if somebody has a broken one that needs fixing, and is otherwise being dumped? 😁




anamnesis

Found it by spending hours and hours on the internet and old magazines looking for hardtops adverts and photo's of hardtops.
Then you also find other spridget related stuf

Another advert from Soldering Instrument components LTD but now more info of it instead of a photo.

Page 76

https://www.motorsportmagazine.com/archive/issues/september-1967/

Anamnesis, how did you "cut and copied" just that advert?
A de Best

Arie,

Do a screen shot ( Shift, command, 5 on a Mac) which allows you to capture what you want and copy to your desktop.




Martin

Arie, on Windows press the Print Screen Sysrq button (to the right of F12 on my keyboard), open your favourite image processing software and paste from the scratch pad (where Print Screen put it to).
Rob
MG Moneypit

Moneypit and Martin Arie.

Except it was my Samsung phone screenshot. 😄.

You did the hard bit just finding it. Lol.



anamnesis

Thanks Martin and Rob, I have Windows so found that "prt sc" button as Rob pointed out.
Tested succesfully!
A de Best

The add shows a Midget with wind up windows, the one with the de-mountable hood (that has the header bar permanently fixed to the hood) so maybe it doesn't apply to side screen cars. The de-mountable hood has extra articulation on the frame anyway (and does away with the sprung legs) so maybe it is just a simple mod to the frame itself.
Just noticed the second add that says it applies to earlier Midgets and Sprites and prices for modified frames. We could do with better images.

Rob
MG Moneypit

Re.the sidescreen cars then certainly the Frogeye, at least, is very quick to erect or remove the hood. I can do either in less than 5 minutes. But, of course, the Frogeye has the internal "cave" and the hood is easily stowed in it. Not so with the boot of the mk2 Sprite/ mk 1 Midget I presume. But won't the mk3 Sprite/ mk2 Midget hood stow behind the seats? I had one back in the day but can't remember what I used to do!
Bill Bretherton

Bill,
The MKIII Sprite/MKII Midget hood, with attached header, won’t fit behind the seats as the header rail is too long. I do though sometimes store the frame behind the seats - in 2 parts.
Philip Sellen


@Arie - Thanks for the link, I know some one who claimed to have had their hood 'modified to fold on a 65 Sprite - but I have never found a/the company that offered it !!

I checked the company closed down in 1999, the two directors were born in 1936/7 so I suspect that's just for info now.


@Bernie - Thanks for the info, I nearly have the rebuilt engine running, so will start to play with the hood soon after, but will attempt to record/note what I find and do.


@anamnesis - the original frame is silly simple to make, but if I get the more usable fixed hood working I'm unlikely to keep the old frame !

@Bill, gettting the hood into a Sprite mk3 boot is a royal pain in the @ss, then you should reach in and secure it with two awful bits of straps.

@ Rob, yes the picture is my age of car and yes the frame is so simple it can't be a massive change - it's more in my case that a free rubber bumper frame turned up - I had a search for an early frame on ebay but never seemed to work - I have no intention of modifying the only frame I have - I have looked at making a new early style but one piece frame in ally tubing but it never made it to the top of the list.

Mal
Malc Gilliver

Philip/ Mal

Thanks, I couldn't remember from the 70's how it was!
Bill Bretherton

Just been to a car meet and a guy there had a D plate Sprite that had the conversion !

I will edit some pictures and post
Malc Gilliver

Initial 'find'





Malc Gilliver

Close up





Malc Gilliver

Had a good look when the owner returned, he was unaware of it being non-standard but now understood why other owners complained about their hoods being a pain.


Malc Gilliver

"I checked the company closed down in 1999, the two directors were born in 1936/7 so I suspect that's just for info now."

Malc, how did you find this info?
In my research for spridget hardtop-companies it would be very helpfull to check and acknowledge who were behind these companies.


I went thrue 25 years (12 issues per year) of Motor Sport Magazine to look for hardtop advertisement and found many intresting things MG-AustinHealey related.
All issue's are digital available and easy to scroll thrue.

Its a fun trip thrue memory lane and was amused by some products being advertised :)

Malc, thanks for the photo's of this mistery frameconversion.






A de Best

Ive not yet seen any of these accessories yet on a spridget





A de Best

Arie,

I just searched for "Soldering Instrument Compant Ltd " and this appeared - https://companycheck.co.uk/company/00831820/SOLDERING-INSTRUMENT-COMPONENTS-LIMITED/companies-house-data

Or you can use the less helpful government site - https://find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk/advanced-search or https://www.gov.uk/get-information-about-a-company

But in most cases https://companycheck.co.uk/ is quicker and easier
Malc Gilliver

I think that company made "Adcola" soldering irons, quite rated in their day (although I still use a 1973 Antex - you can still get bits). Interesting they also made Spridget hood conversions - quite a bit different!
Bill Bretherton

Seeing that photo of a baby in a carrycot reminded me that is how my son used to travel on the back seat of our Hillman Imp. Only we put him in a cardboard box rather than a posh carry cot.
He now has a small son of his own but the total disregard of risk doesn't seem to be hereditary judging by the immense stack of complex and essential 'extras' that seem to be required to move a small child around these days!
GuyW

"-- essential 'extras' that seem to be required to move a small child around these days!"

Such as the child on board notice permanently displayed in the back window. I assume to ward people off driving into their rear end.

As if without that notice, they WOULD be rear ended, but that magic notice prevents it. 😅😅



anamnesis

Way back when my wife would go places with her family, being the youngest of three, she would get to lie down on the parcel shelf in front of the rear window of the big American family sedan. No carrier required. Since I had only the one sister there was no need to use that convenient space.
Martin

I recall a carry cot similar to the Shell one. We used to put my daughter (now 37!) in it behind the seats of the Frogeye on the axle'hump'. Never really thought about the safety angle just that it seemed fairly secure there. The child seats now are serious bits of kit using Iso-Fix etc. Its for the better.......
Bob Beaumont

@Bill, you can see the name 'Adcola House' in the advert, but the directors of the Midget hood place were the same as Adcola
Malc Gilliver

Malc,

The UK Companies house online is a bit of a PITA with older companies as I think they have a 25 year cut-off beyond which you won't find the information so that company will be listed currently but maybe not in a year or 2, even if present in the past once the time threshold is met I think the only way is to contact them direct. The other site you mentioned does seem to retain data longer as I've found information there that's no longer listed at Companies House online. The UK patent office online is much the same as UK patents I can get from the European patent registry back into the early 20th century and earlier aren't available on the UK patent site.
David Billington

Thanks for the Link Malc but as Davis says there isnt much found on the older companies...

I guess that the officials are not intrested to digitalise info on old companies? or remove info if older then 25 years.

Incorperated 1970/71 is seen on several companies who were older then that, was that because of national change of companies status or due to the Chamber of Commerce?

the link https://companycheck.co.uk/ did gave me some info on hardtop producer Omnibob.
Name and adress of the now pensioned owner.

A de Best

I can now write mr Michael Graham Macrae a letter for information/photo on his products and he might remember the other companies at the time and perhaps know who made my hardtop... ;)





A de Best

Looks like there is a red mg or Etype in front of the house :)
A de Best

@David, I don't search very often but so far 'touch wood' what I have needed I have found.

@Arie, I suspect the address you have will have been correct at time of filing, so he may well have moved or, I hope not - died in the meantime, it's fairly common for people who run their company to only give up when they cannot continue.
Malc Gilliver

Malc, one of the problems I found is that many companies didnt make it long before starting up again, some on the same adres as their previous buisnes but some moved to other location.

Also some models hardtop were made by several companies so I guess most were not pattented but therefore making it diffecult to who the producers were...

In meantime thrue your link I found some names that go with the company I searched, it helps that their birth date is mentioned to guess if they could be the original owners.
So far those I found by your link are born between 1944 and 1948 so could have started it or take over from dad.

In my quest to find who made my hardtop I get fun out of finding more then nessecary :)
A de Best

I’ve been looking at the above pictures of the hinge arrangement and although it does facilitate a drop down hood, the cockpit of the mk3 Sprite/mk2 Midget is narrower than the later cars so the header rail is just going to sit on the back deck, which looks a bit Heath Robinson and for me is not acceptable, so I much as I would like a folding hood, I won’t be doing the conversion.
Bernie.
b higginson

I can see that, the conversion I found was bit HR, so I plan to have another got at the 1500 hood frame, but I'm fine with it stitting on the rear bodywork - see mk1 golf gti convertable
Malc Gilliver

This thread was discussed between 12/08/2023 and 01/09/2023

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