MG-Cars.net

Welcome to our resource for MG Car Information.

Recommendations

Parts

MG parts spares and accessories are available for MG T Series (TA, MG TB, MG TC, MG TD, MG TF), Magnette, MGA, Twin cam, MGB, MGBGT, MGC, MGC GT, MG Midget, Sprite and other MG models from British car spares company LBCarCo.

MG Midget and Sprite Technical - Movement in tie rod end

I have just bought a Mk1 Sprite and having taken front wheel off to look at brakes, I notice there is a small movement (on one side only)that seems to be coming from the tie rod end, but might be either side, i really cant tell. Is this likely to be the tie rod end needing replacement (it does look like its leaking grease)or is this not a "moving part" so more likely to be steering or at the wheel end?
Sorry if its a stupid question but i am pretty new to this!
Many thanks
Graham V

welcome aboard Graham,

Is the movment in the tie rod itself, or the ball joint itself...I wasnt able to despher...

Most likely Im guessing its in the tie rod its self...namely the inner tie rod...if you get a victoria british catolog, they have a really good blow-up break down of the rack and pinion...you will notice there is a male/female ball and cap assembly that the inner tierod is connected to...there is probably a bit of wear and just needs to be re-shimmed ....rather then explaining it myelf, here is a good artical IIRC its for a MGA...but its the same (type) of rack...and will explain in detail how to re-shim and tighten the assembly


On your rack...its NOT grease but should be oil..

http://chicagolandmgclub.com/photos/a_rack/

Prop
Prop

Prop

Thanks for yr input. The thing is I am having trouble working out where the movement is coming from. Its more a case of hearing a knock when I lift the tie rod end up and down, I just cant see where the movement is - Is there another way I can test to see which bit is faulty?
Thanks for the link, that looks really complicated, is that something a novice should leave to a garage if it is the ball on the inner tie rod?

Many thanks
G Vickers

To completely check a front end to see if it is in the tie rod itself, wheel bearings or in the steering rack, jack up one side of the car.

Make sure it's supported really well because at one point you will have to put your hand under the tire and you sure don't want the car coming off at that point!

Using a knowledgable assistant, the pretty ones might not be much good at this, grasp the tire at the 9 and 3 o'clock position and try to wiggle it in and out. Watch for movement at the tie rod. Watch for movement at the steering rack.

Now comes the scary part. Grasp the tire at the 12 and 6 o'clock position. Try to wiggle the tire. Watch for movement on the king pin and if there isn't any there and the tire wiggles, it's the bearings that need adjusting.

While it's jacked up, grasp a piece of 2x4 or similar piece of wood. Slide it under the tire and lift the end up an down and check for wear in the front suspension.
Clive Reddin 76 Midget

Could not have written it any better clive,

The rack really isnt that complex, but gez is it a bear to disassemble thats the hardest part of the whole rack project.


prop
Prop

Thanks - I have tested it and find you are right- its not the tie rod end. The movement comes when I shake the wheel up and down (that is vertically) and I see there is a very small movement between the bottom of the king pin assembly and the stud axle assembley - that is to say where the stud axle assembly sits on the king pin.
Would this be a bush/washer or something more serious - more importantly, I would like to do it myself but do you think this will be a difficult job for an amateur like me?
g Victors

Sounds like wear in the bushing. I'd like to say you could do it yourself but it requires a special reamer to ream the new bushings and other things. When that job is going to be done on my car, I'm going to farm it out, write the cheque and figure out how much stress I saved.
Clive Reddin 76 Midget

you can order the parts and do the whole thing your self....But Id take the king pins to a machine shop and have them ream it...cheaper then buying the reamer yourself....

Just for kicks, being that your going to most likely have to replace the wheel bearingss anyway...is to pull the couter pin and re-tighten the castle nut that clamps down on the wheel bearing and see if that does anything...might save the hassel of having to do anything till late in the fall, so you can enjoy the nice weather now.


Its a shot...50/50 ..it will work or it wont!!!

prop
Prop

Thanks. I will have a go at Prop's idea for a quick fix for the short term and let you now how I get on. I have not driven the car yet and am desperate to take it out. Here in the UK its illegal to drive an old car without a MOT (safety) certificate so cant do a thing till I get that.
g Victors

If there is vertical movement then take the trunion off (the bit on the top held on with a castle nut) and check there are no shims in the very centre face. these shims are to adjusty a perfect amount of load on the copper bearing washer that sits under the trunion and too many will give the movement you see - too few and the stearing won't move, so you may have to go round this game a few times
Will Munns

Sadly I now think the problem is wear at bottom of king pin where it joins wishbone as well as where king pin sits on stub assembly. I reckon as pin is so difficult to take out, I will need to get new wishbone as well as king pin & hub assembley. More expensive but looks probably a lot easier. Only difficulty I now need to overcome is apparently I need to have hub assembly sheaned to take king pin & supplier doesnt do this. No idea how to do it so I guess I will ask local garage. Thanks for all the input.
g Victors

OOUUUuuuuuu!!! sorry, Its alot harder then it looks...your best friend is an angle grinder.....if your going to have a garage do it, PEASE avoid the modern garages and take it to an actual british classic car garage...if you take it to a modern garage you will just get ripped off and end up re-building it yourself in the end

its not all the shops fault...you have an over ambitisios shop salesman that thinks his guys can fix any thing and you got alot of shop mechanics ander the age of 45 that barely remember the MGB from there youth not to mention the midget....combined with that there are NO computer ports to plug there laptops into...so they are just lost and guessing as to what to do...in the end you will know more about how to fix it then they do....most likely they will just fill in the gaps with some heavy grease which will hold togather about 600 miles and charge you 600 dollars....so even tho the british classic car shop will charge as much as twice the rate as a modern car shop rate....you are so far ahead of the game...even if you had to pay 5 times the modern car shop rates....in the end, I found I have to do everything myself....and only recently found a really great classic british car shop almost 300 miles away, that is worth there wieght in gold. Not to mention devoloping a great relationship with the shop owner, and all the benifits that the relationship comes with, its just invaluable.


I just cant emphise this point enough...Avoid the modern day car shops...it just isnt worth it. unless you own a 2008 cadillaic then by all means take it to them, they will do a great job...Im certian...just not your midget.

prop
Prop

GV, the sensible way of rebuilding is to buy an exchange stub axle complete with kingpin, they come already rebushed and reamed with the pin fitted.
David Smith(davidDOTsmithATstonesDOTcom

This thread was discussed between 22/04/2008 and 25/04/2008

MG Midget and Sprite Technical index

This thread is from the archive. The Live MG Midget and Sprite Technical BBS is active now.