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MG MGA - help mounting vacuum pipe

Folks,

I need a little help mounting a new vacuum pipet from the distributor to the carb.

I can't find a schematic that shows where the bracket that holds the body of the vacuum assembly attaches to the left side of the engine body.

Can anybody direct me to a schematic or decribe where it goes.

I've seen picture and it appears to mount to the engine body behind the heat shield.

Thanks
Tysen

Tysen, the New pipe I got from Moss was mounted with the bracket to the back manifold bolt with the bulb vertical and next to the rear head bolt with a loop clip and on to the distributer. I have some pictures taken with my current re-assembly of the car after painting. I will try to get them posted.

I think this is the correct routing.
Jim
Jim Ferguson

Tysen, this link has some pictures of the re-assembly of the heater shelf/dash that I am now working on. It showes some of the vaccum pipe that may help you.

http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/liledoun/album?.dir=/2f3b&.src=ph&.tok=phwEJpEBvm3Oq3XN

There are some other pictures from the past couple days.

Jim
Jim Ferguson

Tysen

My bracket is attached to the rear stud that also holds the brass firing order/tappet clearance plate. This is also born out by the bottom picture, page 56 in Clausager.

Steve
Steve Gyles

Tysen

Following on from my previous post, here is my arrangement:

http://freespace.virgin.net/stephen.gyles/odds_and_sods.htm

Steve
Steve Gyles

Gentlemen:

Thanks so much for taking the time to post the pics.

They're very helpful

Best,

Tysen
Tysen

Guy's I've been pouring over clausager and pictures on this web page and I'm fairly certain that the bracket that holds the body of the vacuum pipe actually bolted down to the stud that holds down the exhaust manifold. Not the first one at the end of the motor but the inboard stud that's backed by a washer.

Does that nut have a torque specification?

Tysen

Tysen

Most interesting. Just looked in my Moss Catalogue and the shape of the bracket would suggest that it fits where you say.

However, my bracket is an original. It is a different shape and bent differently.

Does this mean that 2 designs of the bracket were produced by the factory or has Moss got it wrong?

Steve
Steve Gyles

Interestingly I have not seen one like yours Steve although it looks like an easy mod to do by bending the original. The problem as you will notice is that the stud where it is mounted is not long enough for this arrangement and therefore the nut is only partially fitted.
Why do you believe it to be original?
Bob (robert) I am turning? yes I once owned an MGWasp!!

Bob

Yes I concede it could have been bent like that by the previous owner. I had never given it any real thought before this thread started. I can see why the previous owner may have done this. It is certainly a lot easier to remove the assembly complete.

The nut stands 48 thou high on its thread compared to the other side. However, between them they only hold the cable bracket, brass plate, flame trap bracket and a pipe clip, so in my opinion not that critical.

Everything in the engine compartment suggested being original when I bought the car, so I have no reason to doubt the originality of this item. However, it is square section and not tapered as shown in the Moss catalogue.

It never ceases to amaze me what items of detail differences turn up on this forum.

Steve
Steve Gyles

Steven,

Hard for me to say. Tho all the pictures I've seen are set up as I've described.

I'm quite sure that they could've changed the approach over the years.
Tysen

Steve I was not suggesting that the nut on this stud was a problem, I was simply suggesting that from an engineering point of view that this stud would have been specked up longer had this been the original fitment. The person who sold you this car has obviously being telling porkies, or there again maybe not?
Bob (robert) I am turning? yes I once owned an MGWasp!!

Bob

Yes, I agree with your point.

The 'originality' issue is my interpretation of everything I found in the engine bay. Bits and pieces that I took back to Bob West for inspection/trade-in were all thought to be original items - the radiator, distributer and carbs were a few items in particular.

The car was all in a very sorry state having been in a 'barn' for 22 years. The previous owner had lost the car to his wife as part of a divorce settlement! (How could he!!!) She then appeared to have just let it stand idle for all those years.

I am coming round to agreeing that the bracket fitment on my car is not standard. I have just been having a closer look at it and the bend is very, very slightly off true. Any comment on the overall shape? Is the Moss replacement wedge shaped as suggested in the diagram in my catalogue?

Steve
Steve Gyles

I have just fitted a new (Moss) vacuum pipe with my recent rebuild to replace a mangled piece of pipe without a flame trap.

The new pipe came with a P-clip to attach the pipe to the rear cylinder head stud (that's a definite) and seems qite adequate for the job.

There was also another bracket supplied to clamp the flame trap body, but had not sussed out what to do with it - I'm off to the garage see if I can get it anywhere near that rear manifold stud mentioned.

Pete
Pete Tipping

Two days later...
Eventually found the new angled flame trap bracket that came with the pipe. Now, with a bit of a struggle, I had carefully bent the new vacuum pipe to where it needed to go and lo & behold with this bracket fitted to the rear manifold stud I will only have to raise the already vertical trap about an inch and very slightly closer to the engine and it'll be there!

Thanks all and hope this helps Tysen.

Pete
Pete Tipping

Tysen:
I'd be curious to know which photos in Clausager lead you to think that it is the inboard manifold stud to which the flame trap bracket should be attached. I have not completely installed my vacuum advance pipe because, in part, after pouring throught Clausager and other references, I was not sure where to attach this bracket. My sense was that its attachment point was closer to the end of the manifold.

Regards,
M.D.
'57 Coupe
M. D.

M.D.

Look at page 56 bottom photo. You can clearly see the flame trap sitting between the No.3 and No.4 exhaust outlet.

Steve
Steve Gyles

MD

In addition to the page that Steven just noted see this photo from this web page.

http://www.mgcars.org.uk/pics/mga191.jpg


Pete, how the blxxdy hxll did you get a torque wrench behind the heat sheild to tighten the stud nut.....moreover how the hell did you get the wrench under the carb body to tighten the fitting from the vacuum pipe the carberator????

Thanks,

TM

Tysen

Tysen

One of the reasons why I guess my bracket was modded to fit the brass plate stud!

Steve
Steve Gyles

Tysen

Nice picture (even if it's not yours). Many a year and 18000 miles since mine looked like that. Most jealous. However, I do drive and enjoy mine, so there has to be a trade in.

Steve
Steve Gyles

Me again. having a closer look at that photograph, I don't think the owner was going anywhere fast with the throttle cable like that. Also the intake manifold should be red along with the heat shield. Interestingly, the item we are talking about (the flame trap bracket) appears to have it's clamp bolt like mine - 90 degrees out to the manifold stud - or are my eyes deceiving me again?

Steve
Steve Gyles

Steve,

I think you are right. The bracket is certainly mounted to the stud bolt as we've dec, but the nut clamping the body of the flame trap is appears 90 degrees from were mine will be.

Hmmmm. This car is in europe somewhere, could it be a different part provider?

Just when you think you've pinned it down........
Tysen

Flame trap bracket should be on the REAR manifold stud (hell, it's hard enough to get in the area where this one is mounted without yet another obstacle...)
dominic clancy

Is it important that the flame trap be vertical. On my car I am not so particular about its placement and mine sit just behind the rear carb but it is not completely vertical. Is this dangerous?. I would hate to loose my car to flames just because of that. Thanks Gord.

PS: I did not even know that's what that little bulb wsa for.
Gordon Harrison

Gordon

There was a lot of talk about the flame trap last year: what it did, what it was filled with etc. I am not sure we all came to an agreement as to its effectiveness but it's in the archives somewhere.

Steve
Steve Gyles

Tysen

You asked - "how the blxxdy hxll did you get a torque wrench behind the heat shield to tighten the stud nut....."

I torque them up before fitting carbies and heat shield.

and...
"...moreover how the hell did you get the wrench under the carb body to tighten the fitting from the vacuum pipe the carberator????"

I use a 3/16" Whitworth spanner before fitting the air filters.

Pete
Pete Tipping

Just spoken with Bob West. He insists that the original position is the second stud in!

Steve
Steve Gyles

On this sole occassion I have to agree with Bob West, I to believe the original mounting position is on the second manifold stud in from the back. I believe this on the basis of a photograph in the workshop manual that is not clear but does seem to be there.
Regarding torque why do these need to be torqued? It is just a 1/2 inch AF spanner and nice and tight, the same as it was done on the production line!
Bob (robert) I am turning? yes I once owned an MGWasp!!

Doh! - Thanks for that Steve (how's your brass nuts today) - my flame trap bracket got itself fitted on the rear manifold stud today and that was a struggley spannering job. Another look tomorrow then... must be a bit tight in there on the second stud in...

Pete
Pete Tipping

Further to Bob's Reference to the Workshop Manual, I have a 1963 copy of P.Olyslager's MGA manual. A photograph on page 21 appears to show the flame trap close in to the brass plaque, locating it between No3 and No4 exhaust manifold.

Steve
Steve Gyles

Bob

Do you know you could be right about simply tightening those manifold nuts nice and tight. I torqued them up to the stated 25ftlb, after a rebuild and am now carefully running in the old lady. At just 200 miles, when retro-fitting that flametrap, I discover the new brass manifold nuts with lock washers are all basically loose. Any looser and they would have come undone! So I just tightened them up nice and tight again - Bob.

Pete
Pete Tipping

This thread was discussed between 01/04/2006 and 11/04/2006

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