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MG MGA - ID plaque

Does the car # (registration number) appear anywhere else on the car other than the data plate?

I'm asking because I've seen a few with data plates that appear to have been removed and replaced with everything from pop rivets, philips screws, plated slotted screws, etc.

This sends up a red flag because the trooper that comes to the house to verify a 'clean' title and proper tags can jack you up if he isn't happy.

Thanks.

MAndrus

That's the only place that the car number appears. There is a body number on the firewall and a chassis build number on the crossbeam in the left hand cockpit just forward of the seat (usually rusted away or pitted beyond recognition), but no, there is no other car number.

Steve
Steve Gyles

surely the number stamped on the chassis should be the same number as appears on the chassis plate in the image -
DM Gibson

No. It's a chassis welding team's unique number. Each welding team had its own series of numbers.

Steve
Steve Gyles

I also thought the VIN number was stamped on the chassis rail...
Neil MG

You live and learn. You are correct Neil. Appendix 1 of the latest Call It MGA says that the number, but not the letters, was stamped on the right side cross member in front of the right seat. I always knew about the frame build number on the left cross rail, but not the number on the right.

Steve
Steve Gyles

So, I can get an owner or dealer to confirm the data plate number against the number on the right side cross member in front of the right seat?

I've driven a day to find a TD with such a mess of numbers.... I wouldn't dare try to register it and wasted a day on the road.

.....
MAndrus

If you can even find the number on the RH cross member, if it has not rusted away. Mine was reduced to the barest fragments of numbers. I replaced that part of the frame with new metal entirely, so the frame stamped number is easy to read now. 8^)

Just keep in mind that many of these cars have had numerous parts and pieces swapped over the years, or parts of many cars combined into one, etc. If you don't know the history of your car, maybe be a little circumspect over how you do your digging. If you can find the number stamped in the frame on your own, and if it matches the number plate, then by all means, document that as backup for the trooper, if he isn't happy.

I wouldn't take it to any kind of a dealer or a shop to verify that... if they find numbers that don't match, or can't find the number that is "supposed to be there" it's entirely possible they could drop a dime on a call to the authorities, and still get you jacked up through no wrongdoing of your own.

I had to have a similar trooper visit to look at my car many years ago because the title had the engine number (plate was long gone from the engine, that engine wasn't in the car at the time, etc) instead of the car number. When he saw that the data plate was held on by SCREWS (oh, horrors!) instead of rivets, his eyes kind of bugged out at first, but I told him that's the way they built them, and since the car was unrestored, there were 40+ years of "patina" attesting to the fact that the number plate was original to the car.

He signed the form, and then launched into a long dissertation about how I must never remove the plate, and how I should carefully mask around it when I repaint the car, etc. I somehow neglected to mention my plans to remove every piece, every nut and bolt from the car, and to have a reproduction plate stamped to replace the nasty old one.

Anyway, good luck with the visit.

-Del
D Rawlins

If you are looking for the number on the right side cross member, it may be quite a job to find, as these are lightly stamped as the crossmember is fairly strong steel. It will be closer to the rear edge, and somewhat centred on the cross tube. With corrosion and wear you may not be able to get all the numbers. If you find them , do what you can to preserve the site.
.. CR
C.R. Tyrell

On midgets and Sprites, you got the number on the rear face of the dash, in wax crayon - plus whether it had a heater, rev. counter etc.

My 1962 had the whole build options spec. on the back of the dash.
Nick and Cherry Scoop

I was able to find both numbers on my chassis. See the attached link. 31994 on the right cross member and 21865 on the left side. The number "3" in my chassis number was the hardest to find because it was stamped crooked and it was a different style than I thought (flat on the top). Be careful when cleaning the area whaer the number is stamped. I used aircraft paint stripper to cleah the area and 0000 steel wool very lightly. I think i was able to find mine because it is a coupe.

http://www.mgexp.com/phorum/read.php?2,2969756,2969756#msg-2969756

Jim
JL Cheatham

If you are unable to read the number on the right hand crossmember but the left hand number is still legible you may be able to narrow your car's authenticity to a small sample of car (VIN) numbers. The following link from my website is an extract from the MGA Register 2005 Year Book which discusses the association of frame numbers to car numbers: http://tinyurl.com/d67dcpz

Steve
Steve Gyles

You can just see mine - see photo - a PO has restamped it next to it to make it clearer - perhaps a requirement in Europe where mine was exported to. A chap in our club also had to do this to his MGB by the DVLA when his VIN plaque went missing.

Cam Cunningham

I am not an engineer, so may be a stupid thought. Can you xray metal to show up the disturbance of the molecular structure caused by the number stamping? i.e. even though the numbers may not be visible to the eye because of corrosion maybe the good metal underneath remains molecularly 'disturbed' by the hammered number?

Steve
Steve Gyles

I'm not sure if it's done by Xray or some other method, but it's not uncommon in police forensics to recover serial numbers from firearms which have been filed or ground off by criminals. As you suggest, the metal is disturbed when the numbers are stamped or rolled into the metal, and I know that it is possible to recover an obliterated number (as long as it hasn't been welded over or something). I just don't know for sure how it is done.

-Del
D Rawlins

I remember reading a long time ago about how they recovered numbers like Del says. Some how acid was used and because of the numbers being stamped the metal was denser in that area. The acid would remove the softer area around the stamped numbers making the stamped areas stand out. On things like motorcycle frames the bad guys would drill thru the serial area and re weld removing them completely.
gary starr

This thread was discussed between 08/07/2015 and 14/07/2015

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