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MG TD TF 1500 - Genuine Mark II TD/C on eBay

A genuine TD/C on eBay has been in the same family since 1954, and, other than having one fuel pump removed and a wooden dash, is in quite original condition. Item 120603481276, at $12,000 with no bids yet, but buy-it-now at $16,000. Seems to have been cared for.

Tom TD/C 10564
t lange

My limited judgement is that if you could buy it at that price and bring it to really TOP condition for $10,000 you would be at the very upper range of the market. I further judge that $10,000 would not nearly cover it.

With warm regards,
Dick Thomas
Wooster, Ohio
Dick Thomas

Dick - I agree but don't remember mentioning anything about a restoration. As with even the cheapest of MGs, the cost of a restoration will certainly exceed the raw dollar value at the end, and this car is no exception. If one could buy it for $12,000 I think it would be a fine driver.

My intention was to point out a genuine Mark II with all the TD/C bits still in place (and rebuilt) that has been in the same family since 1954. Enough confusion and misinformation floats around about the Mark II that the genuine and mistaken mark IIs are worth pointing out, IMHO.

Tom TD/C 10564
t lange

If it is a driver, i think the buy it now price is a steal.... 12 for a running TDII is about right, maybe still a bit low, but this is a MkII.....?
Mine is unrestored and a driver and appraised for 16.... I wouldn't take less for it if i was selling?
gblawson(gordon- TD27667)

I'm going to take the middle ground, and say that I don't think it would be a steal at 12, but a fair price. It's a driver with (apparently) everything working and/or overhauled, including brakes, carbs, suspension, ignition, starter, gauges, etc. My guess is that it's a get-in-and-go car with the usual lots of smalls needing attention - but that's the pleasure of owning a TD.

Gordon - I don't agree that $12,000 for a running TD2 is the going rate. I bought my tatty but 35,000-mile 53 for $5500 on eBay in October of 2009 and had it running within a few weeks, and bought my fire-damaged but complete and running Mark II for $5200 in 2008, also on eBay. I think you can still buy a decent TD driver for $8,000; remember that tatty engineer's TD on eBay last month, stored since the 70's but with a Marshall-Nordec blower, that sold for about $6,800 after the auction closed - and that from a New Jersey dealer!

Bargains are still out there. Tom
t lange

I:
Your knowledge is far superior to mine on this subject. We approach it through different eyes.
From my stand point I couldn't live with the engine compartment looking anything like the one pictured no matter how well it ran (although based on how it looks I have some doubts that it really runs well). I also have some unfounded doubts that anything in the vehicle is in any better condition than the motor area. But that is a personal position which many will not share for good reason.
A'll give you that the history is remarkably and unusually clear but that alone wouldn't do much for me as the car sits in my garage. But that is also a personal view probably not shared by many.
With warm personal regards,
Dick Thomas
Wooster, Ohio
Dick Thomas

The engine plate is not shown. Please correct me if I am wrong about this, but I've always thought that the mark II engines were equipped with pancake filters on their 1 1/2" carbs, and not the regular oil-bath type.
Also wondering if the right bonnet panel has the bulge that should be present to clear the above carb setup? There is only one shot of the right side, and I don't think that it is present.
One needs to be very carefull about the swapping that could have gone on during the last almost 60 years. Back in the 60's, these were just cheap old cars, and were often bastardized from wrecking yards! My car is a late TD with the proper numbers matching engine plate, but someone swapped in an earlier engine and kept the plate. I thought that it was just an early short-reach plug head, but when I had the pan off, I found that it had an early style oil pick-up.
Steven Tobias

A bulge can be clearly seen in front of the cooling slats? And the Mark 2 did have oil bathfilters but they should be bigger than standard. I not expert enough to judge if this filtersetup is MK2.
Willem vd Veer

Willem, I did a bit of research and found that I was ignorant about the finer points of the TD II. The pancake filters and hood bulge came at a later build date; car #22613. One should still do due dillegence and check the engine and accessories, but it looks like the real deal.
I don't think that I'd want to pay 12-16K for a car in this condition, but there are probably individuals that would pay for the its uniqueness.
At a local car show in April 2009, I met an individual that had recently purchased a late TD from a long time owner that had accomplished a fair amateur restoration. The new and inexperianced owner was more of a muscle car guy, but was pleased that he had paid very little for the car. I noticed, right away, that the car had the right hood bulge and Andrex shocks. I asked to see under the hood and he took me aside and said that he was embarressed to leave the hood open because the car had a Volvo engine! After I explained that the rest of the car might be a mark II, he informed me that he had the origional engine and transmission in his garage and that they came with the car. His fellow car club members had told him that he just had a couple of aftermarket accessories and that the car was just an ordinary TD/Volvo clone. I met him this past april at the same car show, and he thanked me...upon checking and researching, be verified that he did have a mark II, and he had indeed gotten a bargain!
Steven Tobias

Just to add alittel to the discussion:

My MkII late TD has a larger oil bath air cleaner, and I am pretty certain all MkII's had this right to the end. The upstream arm of the air inlet requires the bulge towards the front of the RH side of the bonnet side, and it is there. No pancake filters until the TF.

What is noticable about ths example is that it is an earlier version without the MkII badge on the bonnet (sorry guys; hood), or on the rear bumper.

It is good to see the Andrex shocks still in place and working.

I do wonder why the second petrol pump is missing and what it indicates in terms of other changes.

IanB
Ian Bowers

One of the reasons I started this thread is to point up the common errors that surround Mark II cars.

As did standard TDs, the Mark IIs evolved, with no announced changes. The air filters are probably the most confusing and often-incorrect part of Mark IIs. Here is what I believe, based on observation and discussion with Mark II owners:

1) All Mark IIs had 1-1/2" SU carbs, the front AUC 3012/12, the rear 3012/18. These carbs are different from the 1-1/2" carbs used on TFs and MGAs, which although they will fit in place, are neither original to the Mark II nor will they allow the use of original air intake systems. ONLY the 3012/12 and /18 carbs are original and correct for the Mark II.
2) No pancake filters were ever used on factory TDs, nor have I found any evidence that cars were ever delivered without any air filtering system at all.
3) Early Mark IIs used the stock 1-1/4" air intake snorkel (as I like to call it) and the associated standard oil bath filter, fitted to the 1-1/2" carbs. These early carbs can be identified by sideways elongated holes on the carb snorkel flanges, allowing the narrower bolt pattern of the 1-1/4" intake snorkel fit the 1-1/2" carbs. [This may seem unlikely to be a factory fitment, but I have seen literally dozens of carbs with this feature, and there can be no other explanation.] The snorkel support stud underneath was presumably re-located 1-1/2" towards the engine to fit the support bracket on the intake manifold. These 1-1/4" parts strangled the engines as Tom McCahill notes in his Mark II review in Mechanix Illustrated (June, 1952), and prompted most owners to remove them entirely. I say "presumably" because I have never actually seen one of these with a re-located stud mounting hole. I am confident they exist, probably unrecognized; otherwise the snorkel would have no support, and would lead to breaking of the carb flange.
4) Later 1-1/2" SUs used a re-cast and enlarged intake snorkel with a widened bolt pattern, along with a larger oil bath. These later carbs do NOT have elongated holes on the snorkel flanges, but are otherwise unchanged.
5) ALL Mark IIs had the hood bulge, NOT just after s/n 22613, when cosmetic changes occurred.

I hope to write in more detail about Mark IIs and to suggest what is correct for Mark IIs. I'm happy to talk with anyone about Mark IIs in general.

Tom
t lange

I looked on the Merson list and the car is not listed on that. There is another one that is 3 cars newer.
Tom Maine (TD8105)

This is why I read this site every day, history and knowledge is what keeps our cars running...

Mostly, OKAY, so my '50 twisted a half-shaft off, my new Jerry Austin's are ready to go in tomorrow, I found a rebuilt set of shocks on ebay too...and the wife's '53 runs like a top, THANKS ONLY to the corporate knowledge I've learned here(I drive it when she's not looking).

With this as a research tool, I feel "educated" enough to tackle almost anything on my TD's.
...now I need to have a look at that MK-II
-Joe
Joe Walck

I know the owner says this was repainted, but wasn't the grill on the MKII Chrome or stainless?

While it really would be nice totally rebuilt. I think you could get it looking fairly good for another 8,000 over the buy it now.
Bruce Cunha

As I have read in one of my reference books, the Mark II did have chrome/stainless grille slats only on the later cars with the hood and bumper badges. Earlier cars had painted slats just like the standard TD's. I would have to re-read my references to find the exact source.

Most foolproof way to determine if a TD is a Mark II or not is the serial number on the frame. Standard cars are TD xxxxx while Mark II's are TD/C xxxxx. I have heard of owners that have installed the extra fuel pump, added the Andrex shocks and other Mark II bits and passed the car off as a genuine Mark II - NOT.

Other less noticeable features of the Mark II not already mentioned are:
Higher compression cylinder head
Larger intake and exhaust valves
Seperate fuel lines from the tank to each fuel pump
John Masters

This thread was discussed between 05/08/2010 and 06/08/2010

MG TD TF 1500 index

This thread is from the archive. The Live MG TD TF 1500 BBS is active now.