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MG TD TF 1500 - Interesting Makers Mark
|I was cleaning up the bolts for the rear shocks (Girling) today when I noticed the makers mark. It says "Bees" and the symbol is presumably a bee. I love this stuff!
|Bill Reid TD4618|
|Check out the following site Bill. http://www.mg-cars.org.uk/mgtd/mgtd_bolts.htm Plenty of original TD stuff to get you excited. Cheers|
Peter TD 5801
|When I rebuilt the rear springs on our TD, the makers mark was this.|
|Also, I found after removing all the paint on the fuel tank. That the tab on the filler has the MG stamped on the brass. It was just a blob of paint before.|
I really enjoyed your enthusiasm for discovering the manufacturer's casting on the bolt head.
I get a little disheartened when restorers throw away all the original bolts,nuts,set screws etc. and replace with the dreaded new stainless steel variety ! Each to his/her own of course.
Some of the original bolt manufacturers that supplied Abingdon for TDs and TFs included, BEES,SPARTS,NEWTON,NEWALL,GKN,RUBERY OWEN and CLR.
|I haven't run across a Bees bolt like that. Neat find! I have lots of R.O. and Newton hardware and some others. Also lots of original American stuff from Fords, tractors, etc.|
Berry was the spring manufacturer for TCs but I hadn't seen it on a TD before. Interesting! The TC springs also had "M.G." stamped into them above a 5-digit part number. The farther back you go, the more elaborate they were with this stuff.
|From my rear spring leaves...
|Bill Reid TD4618|
|Bill Reid : notice that the stamped is 90 degrees to mine above|
|Judging from the BEES bolts on my car they must have eliminated the cute little bee image by the time the TF's came along.|
|J K Barter|
|Here are a couple more Bees after I plated and polished them.
|As I am sure you realise, they used multiple suppliers and just because you find an original BEES bolt in a particular place on one car it doesn't mean even the next one made will be the same. My Pa worked for BMC in the 1970s and he would say that no two cars are ever exactly the same, the difference might just be a washer or a nut and bolt, but it will be there. The real shame is that most, if not all these suppliers disappeared years ago. I admire those who have enough attention to detail to keep the original bolts, but it wasn't for me. I have a pal who removed and kept every bolt, had them replated and put them back exactly where they came from, that's impressive.|
|On my 52 TD (TD16175) I have found all the bolt suppliers marks listed by Rob Grantham. I have also found 3 more he did not list. WODEN and NEWALL are two of them. The third is RSDC - the letters are arranged at the 12, 3, 6, and 9 o'clock positions (see photo -the bolt has been zinc plated)).|
I actually did include NEWALL in the list above ! However,you are correct in the additions of WODEN and RSDC.
When restoring our TF1250 some years ago,I was fortunate to retain
nearly every original bolt,nut,set screw etc. All threads were cleaned, run over with a die,mechanically wire brushed,any minor head 'bruising' eliminated and then re cadmium plated.
The current TF1500 rebuild is getting the same treatment.
|Excellent, but I am surprised you were able to get the bolts Cadmium plated. I thought the process was banned for all but certain aerospace applications, zinc plating being used instead for most things. It seems that Cadmium is better for threaded components, if you can get it done.|
You are correct re the aerospace/aircraft use of Cadmium Plate.
However,we are very fortunate in Western Australia to have one of the few Cadmium Plating businesses still going strong. The owner is fastidious and he supplies many aircraft businesses throughout Australia. We are indeed fortunate to have this access in WA. The quality of the Cadmium Plate is first class.
|Most go with zync now but it is too blueish IMHO. My plater has a 'soft chrome' that resembles CAD but I am not sure if it is as hardy as CAD.|
|Did not the factory paint the bolt heads and nuts? RO stand for "rubbery owens" and later or earlier bolts said "owens" I think, as on British motorcycles, etc. Same bolt maker. Anybody ever been able to catalogg where (the factory put) each particular bolt, or people just figure the last guy to take apart the car got them all back in the original place?|
|The bolts on TFs (and I suspect TDs) were Cadmium Plated. However,|
many areas of the chassis were sprayed over black including the bolts.
Some bolts were fitted up at later stages and left exposed in Cad plated form.
For example,the bolts/nuts holding the triangular strengthening horn
bracket in the chassis front extensions on TFs. I have seen a Factory photo of a new TF rolling chassis sitting in the yard with the exposed
Another area is the lower side engine panel sets screws which are 5/16" BSF SPARTS and reveal the Cad Plate. The bolts holding the Lucas Coil on the bulkhead,seem to be generally BEES 1/4" BSF, and so on it goes.
If one is fortunate,and I have been over many years,the majority of the bolts in relatively untouched cars give us a good idea where the different bolt manufacturers were fitted. I really enjoy looking under the rear guards of well restored TFs and observing the original 1/4" BSF Rubbery Owen set screws affixing the guards to the body tub.
Interestingly, the set screws affixing the Vokes Air Cleaner outside plate,are a particular shallow head with no manufacturer's markings.
Chris,I agree with you,the zinc does not look quite right. (To each his/her own of course !)
|Make that 'Rubery Owen ' !|
|And here I thought this thread was about whiskey. :) .|
This thread was discussed between 18/01/2017 and 22/01/2017
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