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MG TD TF 1500 - NAPA EL-13 flasher and positive ground (earth)

I noted a problem using LED taillights in my positive ground (earth) mg td. (See "LED turn signal lights (II)") I tried a simple bench test that raises questions about using the NAPA EL-13 flasher in a positive ground car.

Bench test:

+ I connected the NAPA EL-13 flasher, an incandescent bulb, and a 12 volt battery.

+ When wired up with negative ground (flasher terminals: “X” to battery positive, “L” to one side of bulb, and other side of bulb to battery negative), the flasher pulsed the incandescent bulb.

+ When wired up with positive ground (flasher terminals: “X” to battery negative, “L” to one side of bulb, and other side of bulb to battery positive), the flasher did NOT pulse the incandescent bulb.

+ In the negative ground configuration, the flasher also properly lit the dashboard indicator light (either an incandescent bulb or an LED connected between flasher terminal "P" and battery ground).

My interest is finding a flasher that works in a positive ground configuration and with LiteZupp LEDs. I am presently working with the LiteZupp manufacturer to find an appropriate flasher. I will keep the board informed as I have more information.

Larry
Larry Shoer

Gord Clark suggested Tridon may have a suitable flasher. Does anyone have experience using the Tridon SD13 ("not polarity sensitive") with LED lights?

http://www.tridon.com.au/Products/Product.aspx?SG=8&S=35&G=478&P=104171

Larry
Larry Shoer

This thread is going in directions I can't predict. I am communicating with Novita Technologies, which manufactures the Tridon line of flashers (and is not the same as Tridon Australia). Prior to December 2008, NAPA obtained their EL-13 flashers from Novita Technologies. Since that time, NAPA has obtained their EL-13 flasher from a Taiwan manufacturer.

The change in manufacturer may account for different behavior observed with a NAPA EL-13 flasher when used on a positive ground car and LED lights. My Taiwan NAPA EL-13 does not work in this setting.

Further, I was told by Novita that "the EL13 is not a LED flasher" and that it requires a load resistor to work. Interestingly, the most recent Sacred Octagon suggests the Tridon EL13 works with positive ground cars and LED lights. The Tridon EL13 flasher may be purchased at Auto Zone.

This problem may not yet be solved.

Larry
Larry Shoer

Just an aside...the EL13 is an NB13 in Canada....we are going through the same thing up here...
gblawson(gordon- TD27667)

Hallo Larry,

you can use the original flasher if you fit two resistors 7 Ohm 20 AV parallel to the LED's.

This helps me, because in Germany you cannot buy flashers with positiv ground.

Klaus

Klaus Harthof

Klaus...can you post a pic or drawing as to where the other ends of the wires are hooked (i'm not an electrical guy at all....)
gblawson(gordon- TD27667)

Klaus,

I am looking for a solution that does not use load resistors. One of the reasons to use LEDs is to reduce the current load through the wiring. Load resistors do the opposite, so the overall current load remains largely unchanged.

Load resistors generate a lot of heat. I'm not looking to cook anything with my modifications.

Last night I did some quick tests with an Auto Zone purchased authentic Tridon EL13 flasher. My test bench included a single 1156-type (single filament) incandescent bulb simulating the load of the turn signals and a Super Bright 12 volt LED as the simulated dashboard indicator light, all wired up with positive ground. The flasher worked correctly, flashing the incandescent bulb and the LED. I'll be reporting more on this in the next couple of days, but the Tridon EL13 looks like it can be made to work for our purposes. Stay tuned...

Larry
Larry Shoer

This is an update on the Novita Technologies Tridon EL13 flasher which is sold at Auto Zone in the United States. (Note: this is NOT the same device as the NAPA EL-13 that is PRESENTLY sold by NAPA.)

I installed the Tridon EL13 in my positive ground TD, fitted with incandescent bulbs for the front turn signal lamps and LiteZupp LEDs in the rear. The dash-mounted turn signal indicator lamp is an original style incandescent bulb.

All worked perfectly. The LiteZupp units are very bright and provide much better illumination than the incandescent bulbs they replace. Picture attached (showing left rear LiteZupp LED turn signal, dashboard battery discharge (red), and dashboard turn signal (green)).

To recap some of the other observations I made:
- The dash-mounted turn signal indicator lamp can be an incandescent bulb or a 12 volt LED. I tested an LW-G-12VDC LED from www.superbrightleds.com and it worked great.
- The Tridon EL13 requires some load on the lamp ("L") terminal to cause the flasher to operate. There was sufficient load with my configuration of incandescent bulbs in the front and LiteZupp LEDs in the rear. I do not know whether the Tridon EL13 will operate properly with an all LED configuration (front and rear).
- The Tridon EL13 is stated to be polarity independent, working with either positive or negative ground vehicles.

I will be sharing this information with LiteZupp and am happy to answer any questions about this.

Larry

Larry Shoer

The wacky stuff I do...

The Tridon EL13 flasher consists of a smoked-transparent plastic can and three spade lugs on the bottom (labeled "X" = battery, "L" = lamp, and "P" = pilot or indicator lamp). In an effort to make the Tridon EL13 flasher more consistent with the original Lucas flasher from an appearance standpoint I made the the following modifications:

- Painted the plastic can with some exhaust system flat silver paint that was around.
- Fabricated an aluminum "L" bracket using 1/16" x 3/4" flat stock I purchased at Home Depot or Lowes.
- Dimpled the back side of the "L" bracket with a punch to simulate the raised locations where rivets are found on the Lucas flasher.
- Attached the "L" bracket to the flasher can with JB Weld.
- Drilled and tapped each flasher electrical contact to accept a machine screw.
- Assembled the electrical connections with a star lock washer.

See the attached picture for the end result.

Larry

Larry Shoer

Bump.

Recent questions asked about a suitable flasher for LED lighting. The Tridon EL13 flasher (described above) has worked well for me for the past two years.

You may want to read the reactivated thread from the bottom up.

Larry
Larry Shoer

This thread was discussed between 04/10/2011 and 29/10/2013

MG TD TF 1500 index

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