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MG TD TF 1500 SEAT BELTS FOR MY MGTD BBS discussion at MG-Cars.net
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MG TD TF 1500 - SEAT BELTS FOR MY MGTD
| The MGTD is with me now for 46 years and until now I have never fitted seat belts. With a big tour coming up in September I think it is time to re-consider. I know the arguments for and against seat belts in our cars, and have decided the safest course is to fit them. Can any of the experts offer advice on type of seat belts best suited for a TD, and who may be able to help to fit. The MG is Norfolk, UK based. Thanks in advance for any insight. Doug |
| Doug Wallace |
| The problem Doug is in finding a suitable anchor point that is strong enough for the shoulder strap. Happy to be proved wrong but I've not heard of an acceptable solution. Cheers Peter TD 5801 |
| P Hehir |
| Doug. I fitted lap belts in my TF. I used the same floor mounting points as Horst Schach in his excellent book on restoring the TD. I agree that there is no really satisfactory place to mount an anchor point for a shoulder strap unless you are prepared to hack away the body and fit something akin to an anti roll bar. It has been done that way successfully. Some have also fitted an anchor point to the inner rear wings, but its not a strong point on a timber frame car. If you wish to see how I fitted mine, you are welcome to visit any time.
Dave H |
| Dave Hill |
| I have a TF but I guess the mounting options are the same. I went with a harness. Here is how I did it. Looks great and very secure. Dave 
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| D Moore |
| Peter, The Complete MG TD Restoration Manual: Horst Schach has a detailed explanation and photos on how to install 3 point seat belts. All of the anchor points are to the frame, no sheet metal involved. I installed them on my 51 TD and plan to do so on the 53 TD. Regards Tim |
| Timothy Burchfield |
I did it like Tim explained, using the anchor pointes as described by Horst Schach. I use a Belt coming from a FIAT 124, the red color looks excellent on my blue Car with biscuit upholstery.
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| GK Guenter |
| I went with this lever latch style, however I found them online in an industrial equipment catalog..1/2 the price. Regards, Tom https://www.summitracing.com/parts/sdk-sb-race |
| tm peterson |
a pic. Regards, Tom
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| tm peterson |
| The anchor points in Horst Schachs book are likely to be the best approach for lap belts only. The belts need to be tied into the chassis and not the tub framing. The tub framing has limited value as they are little more than sheetmetal tied into more sheetmetal and would easily give way on anything more than a slow speed impact.
I have stated my previous opinions regarding the shoulder harness and it's location. I believe that it will have very little value as your torso will easily twist out of the shoulder harness in an impact. This is based on the the height and distance from the body in relationship with the ratchet anchor position . Note that shoulder harnesses are firmly tied into the B pillar in modern cars while being directly above and behind the driver. When mounted in this manner the torso is able to be well controlled in a front impact With the mounting that Schachs chose there is an additional three plus feet of belt behind the torso that is free to move around. This extra belting allows the torso a great deal of lateral and torsional movement in an impact to allow the upper body to twist out of the belting. I believe it has Lillie more value than a placebo. Obviously there has been no crash dummy tests to prove that the Schach mounted shoulder harness is effectual or not in a T-series and I would hope that no one would ever have a need to find out. My opinion is ( and it’s just an opinion but sound) that if one wishes a shoulder harness to be effectual in an impact, a four point rollbar or at least a bar at shoulder height be secured to the chassis in the boot area and the shoulder harness ratchet mechanism be affixed to it directly behind and to the side of the driver thus mimicking the positioning in a modern vehicle. This bar could can also be used with a four point compettion style harness of the lever or cam lock design. To take lateral movement out of the equation completely. Bill Chasser TD-4834 |
| W A Chasser |
| Bill, have you ever looked at the attachment points in Schachs's book? The shoulder belt attachment is at the rear frame tub mounting point. It is not mounted in sheet metal or wood. The angle of the shoulder belt is located, in relation to the body, the same in my TD as it is in my Chevy Volt. I'd be no more likely to slide out of the TD belt than I would the Volt or other car's shoulder belts. Tim |
| Timothy Burchfield |
| I use the same belts as Tom Peterson. I purchased them in 1966. soon after I purchased the TD. Initially I just attached them to the floor boards. During the rebuild I changed that. I was always aware that the 3/8 wood floorboards would not hold much. I made new anchors out of 1/4" bar. ( lower left frame). These are secured to the Tie Bar. The arrows point to the securing bolts (Lower Middle frame and right frame) which are the hardened eyelets. (upper middle frame) Jim B. 
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| JA Benjamin |
This is what they look like Jim B. 
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| JA Benjamin |
| Shoulder belts should be mounted above the shoulder, not below, to avoid serious injury. My advice is to install lap belts only (and to not get into a serious accident in a T-Series M.G.) |
| Steve Simmons |
| Exactly. The floor mounting points that Schach uses for the lap belt are the body to chassis mountings, which are very strong and have large diameter bolts. From there to get the belt geometry correct, it necessary to fabricate some strong angle brackets - these need to be at least 3mm thick steel. Dave H |
| Dave Hill |
| I always felt that Schach's rear mounted chassis position for the shoulder strap was problematic. Reassuring to see that I'm not alone in this. Cheers Peter TD 5801 |
| P Hehir |
| Albeit not a perfect set up, the Schachs' method of seat belt installation is the best method (short of installing a roll bar) to protect against the most common type of accident: "According to figures from the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA), out of the 6 million car accidents that happen on U.S. roads every year, over 40% of them (2.5 million) are rear-end collisions. Most rear-end collisions involve impacts that occur at less than 10 mph. On average, there is another rear-end collision every 8 seconds." Any accident in which seat belts in a T Series car fail would assuredly be fatal without seat belts. But the odds say a 3 point system will save you serious injury in the most common accident you are likely to encounter. I'll play the odds with my 3 point system.
Tim |
| Timothy Burchfield |
| It's possible they will save you one type of serious injury, but are just as likely to cause another. It's a gamble. And the worst injury you will probably get in a rear end collision will be neck and back-related because there are no headrests. Shoulder belts won't help with that. Then there is the age-old argument that shoulder belts are a problem in a rollover, but that's another ball of wax. Or perhaps in the case of our cars it's being run over by a huge truck or SUV and not being able to duck! ;) |
| Steve Simmons |
| Whatever you do it will better than doing nothing. My preference is a 3 Point belt system as described by Horst Schach and pray that you must never use it Cheers, Guenter |
| GK Guenter |
| Guenter, you hit the nail on the head. The value of seat belts outweighs the lack of them. It's funny, I was looking for a German idiom to use for "hit the nail on the head" and found out that Germans say the same thing. Steve, a shoulder and lap belt will prevent your body from whip lashing forward after your car is hit from behind. That's especially true if the car that hits you drives you into the car in front of you. Regards Tim |
| Timothy Burchfield |
| "Steve Simmons, California, USA - It's possible they will save you one type of serious injury, but are just as likely to cause another. It's a gamble."
I have new seat-belts in a box that have not been installed for this reason. And, I honestly do not know what is best given heavier/faster modern cars, traffic and an older car not designed for seat-belts. Spoke with a gentleman at an MG show and he said a friend of his was hit and the tub/body was crushed and rotated on the frame by the impact. The occupants were "restrained" by the frame mounted seat-belts while the tub/body was displaced. Anyone who has installed a new floor in their TD and seen how the seats are bolted in-place has to wonder what would happen to them in an accident. Maybe, its better to think of a TD or TF as a type of motorcycle with similar associated risks from an impact? Bill |
| WHTroyer |
| Tim Yes I have his book and contemplated his seat and “shoulder” belt mountings and decided against it for the very reasons I stated and will continue to state. You either appear to have not read my post thoroughly or comprehended it properly. Maybe you got lost while taking snippets of my post to make a semblance of an argument. In any event your misrepresenting what I said in your rebuttal.
The position of the ratchet point ( or belt pivot point) needs to be directly above and behind the shoulder to be an effective restraint. In a T series this can only be accomplished by the use of a four point roll bar or a shoulder bar to carry the ratchet (or belt pivot) poiint. I seriously doubt your Volts shoulder restraint system is 2’ below your shoulder and 2’ to the rear of said shoulder. You are free to think what you will and I hope you never have to test your theory out in anything more than a 10 mph impact. You also seem to be trying to validate your position citing rear end collision statistics from NHTSA What has that got to do with this discussion on shoulder restraints? Note that a shoulder restraint offers absolutely no protection in rear end collisions unless your are the “rear ender” henceforth, a frontal collision. Also note that a properly fitted shoulder restraint’s sole purpose is to control forward torso momentum in a frontal crash scenario. Additionally, shoulder restraints offer zero whiplash protection. That requires a head restraint. So I don’t know what your argument is as your factoids seem to be subterfuge to the discussion. I find “arguing for” the Schach setup is a risk to someone else’s personal safety without any empirical data to back up it’s efficacy. Think about that for just a moment and let it sink in. Are you so absolutely certain that the system will properly restrain another driver/passenger that you would stake your own life and reputation on it? Would you pay for all the hospital and rehabilitation expenses of the injured? Pay the funeral expenses? Hold the hands of their loved ones and say to them, “ I honestly thought it would work, but I never bothered to test it myself before recommending it”. Am I being dramatic? Yes I am but if you don’t get the point that I’m trying to press upon you, and not just you...you’ll never understand. If one installs this setup and then “prays” they never have to test it in a real life situation, that says to me that there is doubt of its intrinsic value. Lap belts? Yes! A sturdy attachment point with a properly located and secured shoulder system? Yes. The “the best method short of” to doing the job right? NO, NOT EVER!!! Being sorta safe with an untested restraint system is not being safe at all. That’s why I don’t and won’t endorse Schachs “shoulder” system Bill Chasser TD-4834 |
| W A Chasser |
| Tim, in our old cars whiplash is caused by the head (not the torso) snapping backward due to a lack of headrests. If anything, I'd imagine a shoulder belt will make it worse by holding your torso in place as your head snaps forward again. That said, it may also save you from impaling yourself on the wiper motor, metal scuttle, windscreen or (non-collapsible) steering column. It entirely depends on the type of collision whether the shoulder belt will help or hurt. In a rollover it will probably hurt. In a head-on collision it should help. But it's true that having the mounting point lower than your shoulder can cause a serious injury, even in a mild collision (racing harnesses sometimes mount lower but that's a different technology). Look where they are mounted on vehicles that come with them from the factory.
Bill, you've brought up one of the important aspects of retrofitting older cars for belts. If the body does shift on the frame and the belts are bolted to the frame, then it can kill you. But, if you bolt the belts to the wooden body then the mounting points may tear loose in a hard collision. For this reason I made a compromise. The outer section of my lap belt is attached firmly to the frame. The inner portion is through the metal gearbox cover. If the body moves, the tunnel should hopefully move with it and give a theoretical 50% belt movement. In a serious enough accident that the entire gearbox cover tore free, at least the initial impact would have (hopefully) been absorbed by the time it did. There is NO way to ensure a seat belt will save you in any otherwise stock T-Series MG, or even any assurance that it won't make things worse. All we can do is arm ourselves with as many facts and as much common sense as possible, and apply that as best we can. Just remember, whatever you choose is literally a matter of life or death if the worst should happen. Not just yours, but your passenger as well! For that reason I hope we all keep an open mind about this topic and continually adjust our thinking as we learn new facts and methods. |
| Steve Simmons |
| As my TF tub is still in rather a lot of pieces it is something of a bare page for potential changes. I wasn’t able to completely appreciate the shoulder strap mounting point in Dave Moore’s harness but was pondering the possibility of adding some discreet reinforcement to the upper rear of the tub to provide an anchorage for a harness rather than what appears to be a point close to the floor.
I appreciate that a harness removes the potential to dive below the level of the scuttle brace as was rumoured to be the strategy recommended if a rollover was imminent. But would appreciate the views of the forum on harnesses for everyday use. Has anyone come up with a discreet design for a rollover bar? I know that is bordering on sacrilege but I will probably be facing serious objections to being able to take my grandchildren for a ride if I can’t demonstrate to their parents that some attempt at increasing safety has been made. Looking forward to any comments. Chris |
| C I Twidle |
| You will need to look in the archives, but I've seen a very comprehensive set-up for fitment of 3 or 4 point seatbelts. It certainly looked to be strong enough, but required quite a lot of work and was quite visible afterwards. If I find any photos I'll email them to you. Dave H |
| Dave Hill |
| Mr. Chaser, you need to get laid. Tim |
| Timothy Burchfield |
| Steve, when someone is struck form behind the body follows Newton's first law of motion and will remain at rest until acted upon by an outside force - the car striking the first vehicle from behind. Also according to the first law the body in the struck vehicle will continue in motion until acted upon by an outside force. Watch this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EkeFAZf7J9E At the .34 mark and at 1.29 mark you can see the body initially moving reward from the impact and then snapping forward . If the dummy did not have a sholder belt the body would have moved forward into the steering wheel.
Regards Tim |
| Timothy Burchfield |
| Steve thank you for your additional comments. The mounting positions that Schachs recommends for lap belts is appropriate in my opinion.
Tim. I wish to apologize to you. We are all entitled to our opinions. Just understand that I am just as concerned about our safety as much as the next person. I simply don’t endorse the Schachs shoulder system. My fear is that it will not provide the protection it is expected to achieve and therefore I am passionate to that end. If you and others are comfortable with your setups then that is what is important for your (s) situation. I simply don’t believe it is a proper layout and that it creates a false sense of security in its design. It should be said that a rollbar in a T-series has its own problems for street use especially when the hood is used. In my case I stand 6’2” tall. With the hood up my head is rubbing on my two bow canvas. For a full roll bar to truly be effective the top bar should be above ones head to prevent contact with the ground. This in most instances precludes one from using the hood. It also limits access to the boot area. If one is less concerned with rollover protection, the four point shoulder bar is a suitable alternative. If the hood is in regular use, a lower rollbar that clears the hood could be used but would not provide proper head protection should a rollover occur. Head rests can be incorporated into the rollbar to limit whiplash in a rear end collision. My tentatative solution is to have the bar be removable. The roll bar being bolted into the permanent chassis mounting fixings or a separate tube and flange adaptation to the chassis fixings where the rollbar can be slid into place and bolted into a stub for quick removal should the bar wish to be removed easily for the existing conditions. My personal choice with either a full rollbar or a simple shoulder bar would be to use a three or four point double shoulder harness rather than a cross the torso arraignment. This will not only limit forward moment but also lateral movement in both directions. I also plan to have two roll bars made up. The first is a track legal setup that has the required height to accommodate both my head and the helmet I use. The second being similar in design but shorter should I wish hood up driving on the street. This is more to support my shoulder harnesses than for full rollover protection. No matter how one wishes to secure themselves in a T-series it must be understood that no system is going to be perfect for all situations. This is especially true due to the construction techniques of the era. There are no engineered crumple zones, no encapsulated passenger areas, no air bags, no collapsing steering columns and the list goes on. All of which we take for granted in our contemporary vehicles. The thought process and engineering simply didn’t exist 60+ years ago. I welcome additional comments and it is my sincere hope that everyone finds a suitable solution to fit their own needs. Safety Fast Bill Chasser TD-4834 |
| W A Chasser |
| Thank you Bill. Well said. Regards Tim |
| Timothy Burchfield |
| Tim I find you previous comment regarding, “need to get laid”’ totally uncalled for and crude. You don’t know me And my sex life id non of your concern! Had I not been writing my previous response when your comment came up I would be have been less inclined to attempt a gracefilled apology. I would hope in the future that you would have a more constructive comment to the discussion rather than lobbing sarcastic cheap shots that have no substance. This is not the proper venue for schoolyard type behavior. Your lack of maturity shows.
Let’s get back on topic Bill Chasser TD-4834 |
| W A Chasser |
| Tim, that's exactly my point. The whiplash is caused by the head snapping back and forth. The lack of a headrest is what will do the most damage here, regardless of whether or not a shoulder belt is used. The initial impact from behind is the rear problem. Slamming into the steering column will only be the bigger issue if you're pushed into another object.
We will never be "safe" driving these cars in a sea of huge, high speed modern vehicles. We can try to make them a little safer and pretend all is well but it's important to have a realistic attitude. If you feel safe driving your T car, then you probably aren't being cautious enough. Being vigilant at all times, in my opinion, is more likely to save the life of yourself and your passenger than any restraint system. |
| Steve Simmons |
| Bill, I'd rather be accused of schoolyard behavior that being an old curmudgeon like you seem top be :-) It was a joke!!! You overacted to a simple discussion about seat belts. Your playing the victim was unwarranted. For example you got bent out of shape because I asked you if you had seen Horst's book. The reason I asked that is that if you had seen his book you wouldn't have made this statement, "The anchor points in Horst Schachs book are likely to be the best approach for lap belts only. The belts need to be tied into the chassis and not the tub framing. The tub framing has limited value as they are little more than sheetmetal tied into more sheetmetal and would easily give way on anything more than a slow speed impact." It is obvious that you hadn't seen the book or you would know that the shoulder belt is attached to the frame not the sheet metal. I suggest you take a deep breath, relax and ponder the fact that you are getting bent out of shape about a technical discussion (not political) on the Internet. See you on the playground.
Tim (still rude and crude after all these years) |
| Timothy Burchfield |
| Steve, you didn't address what would happen to the body without a shoulder belt when the neck snaps forward. After all there must be some force propelling the neck (attached to the body) forward. But we have gotten off topic here. I'm really talking about the value of seat belts in a front end collision. I think you will agree the most value of a seat belt is when your car hits something. I'll sum up my position. Three point seat belts will protect you in some crashes. In those instances when they will not protect you, you would have absolutely no protection from the lack of seat belts. Your injuries could be the same or more likely worse without a set belt in that type of catastrophic crash. Considering the most common type of crash we are likely to have, seat belts are a safe precautions. I'm at a loss as to why anyone would not install seat belts in their T series car. I really wish someone who had been involved in a collision, with and without seat belts would comment.
Regards Tim |
| Timothy Burchfield |
| Steve, regarding head restraints. I don't know if you have seen this before. Mort 50 TD's solution. Tim Photo by Mort 50 TD 
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| Timothy Burchfield |
| I did actually address not wearing shoulder belts, where I mentioned that you could be slammed into a number of unpleasant objects, and also where I mentioned how they might affect whiplash for better or worse depending on the situation. I will absolutely agree that belts are always better than no belts. That said, a lot of people have had severe accidents over history in cars like this (or older) and come out unscathed. I wouldn't take that chance myself, but it just goes to show that the type of collision can vary wildly. I personally know several people who have rolled T-Types with no belts and walked away, but I'm sure not planning to try it myself! And probably a dozen more who have been in collisions, both front and rear. I have a friend's crushed (from rollover) TC cowl in the garage as a reminder of what can happen when we get complacent.
As for the headrests pictured above, I'm sure it's safer but there's no way I would do anything like that to my own car. For me, it would detract from the vintage experience in both looks and driving feel. |
| Steve Simmons |
| Steve, yeah those headrest fall into the, "I'd rather look good than feel good" category. They may be safe but....... Tim |
| Timothy Burchfield |
| Tim I never attacked your character or tossed insults at you and yet you. I simply answered your Question that Yes I had read the book. I have several copies as a manner of fact. I also explained my position. Let me try to clarify since I apparently wasn’t well understood by you and your focused on the tub rear mounting hole. As Schachs book shows the ratchet assembly is being bolted at the rear tub mount (Pics PGs 158-159). This is only a secure fixing at rest. In an accident ( even providing the the timber is new) the forward momentum of the body will split the timber causing the bolt to become in motion. Once the timber fails the ratchet is no longer secure. The pulling action of the now loose fixing will likely cause the chassis mounting to be torn out as well. The chassis mount itself is nothing more than 10 gauge sheetmetal. It is not boxed to maintain its dimensional integrity and will collapse and tear the ole or the welds.
The real issue, as I see it, is the relative positioning of the ratchet assembly and how the strap is pulling down over your shoulder. As this is a technical discussion then let’s focus on that alone. In consideration of the positioning of Schachs mounting arraignment for his shoulder system, can you cite any technical data showing the Schach shoulder restraint is effective given its poor positioning at the rear of the tub? Note: I’m not now asking if the location is secure. It is the height and distance from the shoulder that is at issue and has always been the issue in my mind. Can we agree this is the true source of our difference in opinion? Since quai reference to physics was made, let’s look at this as well. During a mass deceleration (frontal collision) the torso will rotate on the free of restraint side. This is a fact of physics. The unrestrained body side will continue its forward motion (action) when the car is met with an equal and opposite reaction. This continued forward and now torsional movement of the spine ( because only one side of the torso is restrained) allows the torso to slip out of the single shoulder restraint. This occurring phenomena eventually led to why airbags were added to the steering and dashboards. Since few impacts are straight on any glancing blow opposite of the restrained side would exasperate the issue. The torso rotated and continued moving. Again the thought processes progressed and engineering responded. I was a Firefighter/Paramedic for a good portion of my life and have seen enough highway carnage firsthand to understand the body mechanics of motion in an accident. I do have that perspective to work with. Bill Chasser TD-4834 |
| W A Chasser |
| Just some additional food for thought, if you use those one piece type of 3-point belts then you'll be in even more trouble if the shoulder mounting point breaks loose. Once its free of the chassis, the lap belt will be free to loosen itself. My preference in old cars with 3-point belts is to use the old type that adjust independently. You can even run without the shoulder belt when desired, with no effect on the lap belt whatsoever. |
| Steve Simmons |
| Crikey
There's a bit of personal rubbish going on here Tim, in the interests of common decency, as an outsider, it's not nice to read at all On seatbelts- Years ago a friend had a 4point harness in his AH Sprite - no rollbar Unfortunately he upended it and died, He wasn't hurt in the rollover but choked to death with his head pushed down on his chest and unable to breathe or escape being held by the harness By the time the car was lifted up to get at him it was too late There's been mention of rollover bars needing to be above head height which in itself would be best practice, but in my opinion I think any bar somewhere around head height would have to be better than none at all If it has to be 2" lower to allow the roof to fit, just do it, it's going to be better than nothing at all- If you don't want a rollover bar may I suggest a 3 point seatbelt as the max. so that sideways escape is possible if needed Don't fit a full harness without a roll bar Safety Fast willy |
| William Revit |
| Dear All, Many thanks for some great technical information and advice; a lot to ponder and decide in fitting belts to my MGTD. Sorry that this thread turned into a bit of a kerfuffle and hope that all parties are on side. Best, Doug 
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| Doug Wallace |
| Ok let's try to keep it nice. One thing one has to keep in mind is that by today's standerts our cars we love so much are death traps. The gas tanks are there waiting to fail if hit in the rear. A hit in the front by running into something or getting run into by another car or truck is very bad. The doors are about 1 1/2 inch thick and we all know what they made of. A thin sheet metal skin with a wood frame and a inside door card that is about1/4 inch thick. That is not goning to keep any thing out if hit in the side. And in case of a roll over without a roll bar will be a very bad day for you. Now I have lap belts and hope to never need them but there is no way our cars will be as safe as the cars of today. All that said I will still drive my TD and be as carefull as I can. What other drivers do I can't do much about except hope I see in time to avold. Forrest TD/C/22679 |
| Forrest Rubenstein |
| Willy, Doug and Forrest
Thank you for your constructive comments. Doug I’m sorry this thread got a bit ugly. I was simply trying to provide good information and food for thought as you decide the path that will suit your individual need. Willy I do agree that any properly secured roll bar would be better than none. My reason for building either or both bars is a trade off for my own unique purposes. Engineered to be easily replaceable the track legal bar is required to be 4” above the drivers helmet). The idea is that in a rollover the head never hits the pavement. But to do so I can’t run with the hood up on the street. The street bar would allow my hood to be up but I’m compromised in doing so. Either way I’m still held in place by a three, four, five or six point harness system. My suggestion of a shoulder bar only arraignment was for those that don’t require or feel the need to have a full on rollbar. All were only given as suggestions as a means to adapt a full restraint or a three point single shoulder restraint. I do remember the old three piece lap and shoulder restraints these were very common in the late ‘60s to early 70s and then banned when shoulder belt became mandatory. I had them in a ‘70 Ford Pinto and 71 Chevy Vega. The Pinto would later get a bad rap for fiery explosions in rearend collisions. Cheers Bill Chasser TD-4834 |
| W A Chasser |
| I can say from experience that my '53 TD needs seats with head restraints. A couple of years ago I was hit from behind while I was stopped in a left turn lane (waiting for the traffic signal to change.) The car behind me did not stop soon enough and hit me at probably 5mph or less. My head snapped back and it seemed like the front of my TD lifted up. There is apparently very little shock absorbance in the rear bumper. Since we were across the street from a hospital and the driver of the car that hit me worked there we went to the emergency room for a couple of x-rays and a scan. The doctor told me that nothing was broken but that I was going to have a very sore neck (turned out to be an understatement.) My rear bumper and bumper guards were damaged and the rim of the spare tire was slightly affected. The front bumper system of the relatively new car that hit me showed no damage. I had on my seat belt at the time.
If I could get a recommendation on bucket seats with head restraints, preferably with a thin seat back, I would most likely replace the existing seat set-up. Regards, Bobby Loughridge |
| B. F. Loughridge |
| I fitted Cobra style bucket seats in my TF whilst the original seats were being recovered. I liked them very much and found them very comfortable. I am sure that there are similar seats with a much higher back. To mount them I screwed a 3/4" ply base onto the seats and fitted the original runners onto that, then fixed to the original floor fixings. A bit lower than the original seats but none the worse for that. Dave H |
| Dave Hill |
| Hey guys, This thread is in desperate need of some levity. Just wondering if any of you have read http://www.cartalk.com/test-drive-library/tommys-mg-td-1952 This is the funniest article I've read on the safety aspects of our beloved TD, as well as many other quirks we all know about. I suggest you get the article, get yourself a good stiff drink and a good cigar if you're so inclined, and be prepared for a good laugh. (Hope the url works, if not type it in, it's worth it) Mike TD15250 |
| Mike I |
| Just occurred to me. The spair tyre is mounted behind the fuel tank to protect it in case of a rear ender. Kind of like the tires hanging down on a tug boat. See the factory had it in mind when they made them.Forrest TD/C/22679. PS the car talk thing is funny to read. My brother put me on to it years ago. |
| Forrest Rubenstein |
| I beg the forum - Please don't start a thread about that show. Bud |
| Bud Krueger |
| OK Bill. I've let a few days go by to see if you were going to correct yourself but you haven't done so. So I'll do it for you.
Point 1: You said, "As Schach's book shows the ratchet assembly is being bolted at the rear tub mount (Pics PGs 158-159)" Coumter point 1: Schach does not use a ratcheting seat belt system. It is clearly shown on the pages that you referenced that the shoulder belt is not a ratcheting type. You are wrong. Point 2: Reference the mounting point of the shoulder belt -You said, "This is only a secure fixing at rest. In an accident ( even providing the the timber is new) the forward momentum of the body will split the timber causing the bolt to become in motion." Counter point 2: As you have been told multiple times, the shoulder belt fixing point in Schasch's system is mounted at the rear FRAME tub mounting point. I suggest you look at a TD and satisfy yourself that the rear frame tub mounting point is a "steel" bracket securely welded to the "Steel" frame. The shoulder attachment is held to the "steel " bracket with a grade 8 bolt. It is not mounted to the wood frame. Let me repeat, it is not mounted to the wood frame. You are wrong. Simple errors like your, especially with the book in front of you, cause me to disregard your other comments. I hope nothing I said in this post is offensive of school boyish. Feel free to attempt to rebut my points but as far as I'm concerned I'm going to let this dead horse lie in peace. |
| Timothy Burchfield |
| This is TD/c -8151 under restoration. The tub has been pulled back to show YOU the chassis mount. Stop spouting off your mouth when you don’t know what your talking about or can’t understand what has been said. Maybe you’ll learn something in the process Now get over your damn self Bill Chasser TD-4834 
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| W A Chasser |
This thread was discussed between 24/04/2018 and 28/04/2018
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